CHICAGO — Former President Donald Trump opened his appearance at the National Association of Black Journalists’ annual meeting by questioning whether or not Kamala Harris, the first Black vice president, is Black.
“She was always of Indian heritage, and she was only promoting Indian heritage,” Trump said of Harris, who attended Howard University, an HBCU. “I didn’t know she was Black until a number of years ago when she happened to turn Black, and now she wants to be known as Black.”
“I respect either one,” Trump added, “but she obviously doesn’t.”
NABJ’s decision to host a panel interview with Trump and three journalists set off a firestorm in the organization, with some opinion writers and other members frustrated the organization would host someone who has frequently denigrated Black journalists.
But almost as soon as Wednesday’s interview started (more than an hour late), it descended into chaos, with the former president complaining about everything from the questions to the audio quality and making a flood of his own news — reclaiming the news cycle that has been focused on Democrats for weeks.
The exchange over Harris’ race was one of many viral moments that turned the group interview into one of the most revealing moments of the campaign so far.
As Trump rambled on about whether the vice president identified as a Black woman or an Indian woman, the more than 100 journalists inside a ballroom at the Hilton Chicago looked on in shock.
The White House issued a swift rebuke, with press secretary Karine Jean-Pierre condemning Trump’s remarks as “insulting” in a White House press conference during the panel.
“What you just read out to me is repulsive,” she said. “No one has any right to tell someone who they are, how they identify.”
But Trump’s performance was hardly limited to Harris’ racial identity. When Trump finally took the stage — after nearly an hour delay that Trump blamed on technical difficulties and others blamed on a dispute over a live fact-check system — the interview immediately turned hostile.
ABC News’ Rachel Scott asked Trump to identify “the elephant in the room”: the fact that many in the audience didn’t want him to be there as a result of the litany of derogatory comments he’s made about Black elected officials and reporters.
Trump then proceeded to berate Scott.
“I don’t think I’ve ever been asked a question in such a horrible manner,” the former president said. “You don’t even say, ‘Hello, how are you’? Are you with ABC? Because I think they’re a fake news network and terrible.”
Things didn’t get much better from there. Trump made headlines by diminishing the importance of his running mate, JD Vance. (When Trump was asked if Vance was ready to be president on Day One, Trump simply said, “Historically, the vice president, in terms of the election, does not have any impact.”)
He made news on pardoning Jan. 6 rioters. (Trump said he would “absolutely” pardon rioters “if they’re innocent.” And when he was reminded that these people were already convicted, Trump explained that they were “convicted by a very tough system.”)
And he expressed nonsensical economic policy beliefs. (Trump said, on Day One, he would bring interest rates down, which would — he incorrectly claimed — “bring inflation way down, so people can buy bacon again, so people can buy a ham sandwich again, so that people can go to a restaurant and afford it.”)
But Trump also seemed to commit to taking a cognitive test in public to prove that he’s up to the job. “Well, I’ve already taken two of them, but I’ll do it again,” he said.
And he was challenged over his repeated claims that immigrants are “taking Black jobs.”
“What exactly is a Black job, sir?” Scott asked Trump.
“A Black job is anybody that has a job,” Trump said, before adding that there was “an invasion” of immigrants.
In many ways, Trump’s performance tracked with the expectations of many journalists in attendance. The NABJ announced Trump’s appearance on Monday night, frustrating veteran members who felt Trump didn’t deserve to be platformed at the conference. Others were concerned that the format — questioning Trump in a panel — wouldn’t be effective for a candidate with a record of lying without being fact-checked and challenged.
Ultimately, calls for NABJ to rescind its invitation to Trump grew and began to make national headlines.
“To have a presumed orchestrated session with the former president is an affront to what this organization stands for and a slap in the face to the Black women journalists who had to protect themselves from the wrath of this Republican presidential nominee,” April Ryan, White House correspondent at The Grio, posted on X. “I object to this NABJ session with Donald Trump in Chicago.”
NABJ 2024 convention co-chair Karen Attiah resigned from her role in apparent reaction to the decision to have Trump, among other factors. “While my decision was influenced by a variety of factors, I was not involved or consulted with in any way with the decision to platform Trump in such a format,” Attiah, a columnist at The Washington Post, said on X.
NABJ leadership defended its decision to invite Trump, citing its decades-long tradition of inviting presidential candidates during an election year to speak at the conference. In response to questions about why Harris wasn’t on the convention program and claims that the organization was choosing to platform one candidate over another, leadership said scheduling conflicts and logistical considerations barred the vice president from attending the conference but that it is negotiating with the Harris campaign about future programming.
“We have people whose lives are depending on what happens in November,” said Ken Lemon, NABJ president. “This is a great opportunity for us to vet our candidate right here on our ground.”
It’s been rare in the last four years for Trump to agree to a live interview with media that isn’t friendly or partial to him, and Wednesday’s interview produced more news and revealed more about his thinking than practically any interview in years. Panelists forcefully questioned Trump throughout, and he, in turn, frequently dodged answering questions directly. At one point, he kept lamenting that he couldn’t hear because of the NABJ’s sound equipment, which he said muffled the panelists’ voices.
Despite the chaos of the moment, the former president was forced to answer questions not typically asked in friendlier settings.
In one instance, Scott asked Trump to react to Republicans’ consistent attacks on Harris as a “DEI hire.” Trump, instead, wanted Scott to clarify what DEI — diversity, equity and inclusion — really means.
“How do you define DEI?” he asked. “Give me a definition.”
Asked by Semafor’s Kadia Goba whether he’d be willing to step down as president if he felt his health declining, Trump said he would.
“In fact, I’ll go a step further. I want anybody running for president to take an aptitude test, take a cognitive test,” Trump said. “People say it’s not constitutional. I’d like to have something passed where you can do it.”
Trump, if he wins in November, would still be president when he is older than President Joe Biden is now, Goba pointed out. “But not mentally,” Trump said.
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Jasmine Wright is a reporter at NOTUS. Tinashe Chingarande and Calen Razor are NOTUS reporters and Allbritton Journalism Institute fellows.